Well, I finally got two completed and swapped for my current L&R temporarily. I sat down and listened to Hans Zimmer - Live in Prague, start to finish. This is with no EQ. After that demanding disc, I am very impressed. They are easily the 2nd best speakers that I have owned (I have a set of JTR 212-HTLP for my front stage, that BMS mid/high coaxial driver is a monster). I listened with only the pair of Vortex-12s and subs. The Vortex were crossed at 80 Hz. They are noticeably less efficient than the JTRs (then again, what isn't), but still get plenty of loud with two channels of the Crown DCI 8/600 driving them. They were smooth and appeared to have plenty of ability to handle the dynamics of the varied instruments and volumes of the Hans Zimmer concert. Outside of tweaking my subs, I believe I have found my endgame setup regarding speakers. The -12s handling the supporting 12 spots, and the JTR the big 3. I should finish #3 tomorrow and then calibrate Dirac with them as the front stage. After this weekend I will update my impression with action movies. I plan to listen to them in this configuration for a few weeks at least. Many thanks to Erich and Matt for bringing this great speaker to market. I really hope that it will be resurrected at some point. It`s only fair to point out that all in, including materials to build the box, they are 1/10 the price of the JTR 212HTR. At their original price, that number would be around 1/6.
DIYSG has been a game changer for me. My gateway was the HTM12s. Although I did not have the JTR 212HTR for critical A/B testing. I had a chance to listen to them at someone's house. I couldn't tell you which one is better but I don't think the JTRs were 9x better if we are comparing prices. Don't get me wrong, JTRs are end game speakers. I just couldn't shell out the cost with DIYSG able to get you close to that level at a fraction of the cost.
I agree completely, they are the cost vs performance champ, period. I would never have been able to get the JTRs if it they didn't come from the AVS classifieds. I was able to pick them up for $3000 for the set. Being an aircraft mechanic, I had to crank out the overtime. Lol.
Finished the 3rd cabinet yesterday and temporarily replaced my JTR center channel. I watched War of the Planet of the Apes with the Vortex-12 as LCR. Again, they really impressed me with their clarity and dynamics. You could pick out all the details of the somewhat muffled "ape" speech, and they handled the explosions/action without breaking a sweat. With Dirac taking more effort/time to adjust with the lackluster Emotiva XMC-2, I have not done that yet. I`m hoping to complete it sometime this weekend.
I just finished cutting my third sheet of MDF into small pieces for the pair of Vortex-15's I will be building soon. I was going to put three window braces inside and then do something up by the driver. I am using Matts cabinet size, 17W x 18.5D x 44T. Bracing every 10 inches should be sufficient? I am doing a double baffle so I can flush mount the driver and have plenty of wood behind it to mount it to. Overkill probably but that's fine.
Matt, I was thinking of building cabinet for Vortex 15" with wider baffle since the room they are going has the width but not a lot of depth. You mentioned having a bigger baffle (wider than 17" on each side) would make the sound bass heavy. Is that the same as "boomy" - similar to cranking the gain on your sub? Aside from adjusting the crossover, which is not really an option for me, you recommended is EQ/room correction. My question - will this be something I can fix with EQ/room correction - easily? Easily, meaning half a day of REW. Or would it greatly affect the sound that It will never sound as you designed them? See cabinet style attached. Thank you sir,
I don't have JTR's, this is the only way I can attempt to make something comparable to them. I had looked at buying JTR's, just couldn't do it. I am the only one really listening to this setup. Felt if I was to spend "our" money it should be for something we would both enjoy. Gotta keep the wifey happy. I have a set of 1099's though that these will probably replace. If they do, then the 1099's get pushed back for surround duty. The center 1099 will stay up front. There are also two sets of Vortex-12's waiting for me. One thing at a time......
I am curious about the baffle being set back like that. While I like the look, does it have any negative effects on the frequency response?
Matt mentioned the issues on pg 1 -someone asked about a vortex wall. Coincidently, there is a guy in my FB group who made a baffle wall. He mentioned that he did not eq or modified the crossovers BUT he made the cabinets smaller and tuned it higher. Attached is his LCR
That looks like "Tarponators" wall. I would love to hear it in person. I`ve often wondered how Vortex`s mounted so close to the sidewall and pointing straight forward would perform. I bet the two 24`s and 21`s really pound. Mickey
@Matt Grant Does it matter if I use side panels measuring 18.5" wide by 44" tall instead of 17"w x 44"T? I am not sure how I cut them large like I did. I can certainly cut them down, I am not looking for any gain in the low end. I am using two 4" ports 4" long, seemed a little easier than trying to do a slot port and Parts Express had them for $1.98 each. I also cut the inner baffle the same width as the front baffle since I am veneering these. That will also add a little bit more volume inside the enclosure. Didn't think it really mattered. These are getting used with subs so if they "only" go to 40Hz or so that is fine.
It's not the bass per say but more of the lower midrange which becomes more pronounced (muddy) while losing some output just above that range. This is because the diffraction/baffle step frequency moves down with the wider baffle. Here I have simulated the diffraction/baffle step of the stock cabinet baffle which is what the crossover was designed around compared to a 24" x 32" baffle (I just invented some dimensions), the bottom line is the difference between the two baffles which is what you can expect the stock frequency response to shift by:
Thank you Matt for explaining. I'll keep it in the 17" wide x 18.5 deep. I'm not sure if I can get the 44" tall pass the WAF. I may make it shorter. I have not decided yet if it will be 3, 4 cu ft. (I will subs for the low end). I am definitely making them slot port instead of round ports. Would the slot port dimensions be different depending on the cu ft? Would it still be 15.5" x 1.5" x 4"? Also, what would be the tuning for 3, 4 cu ft? Thank you,
Yes the slot port can remain at 4" long for both volumes, at 4 cuft I expect it will tune the enclosure somewhere around high 30's-40Hz, while in 3 cuft it would be around the mid 40's.
All panels cut and ready for gluing. Need to drill two more holes in the back panel for the switches for the MF & HF pads. Have holes for the SpeakOn connector and Binding Post Cup down by the ports. thinking of putting the crossover up top by the driver just in case I ever need to get to it in the future. Going to put three braces per panel starting down by the ports and moving up. Will do some sort of bracing around the driver once I see how everything else looks. I cut one window brace with a jig saw then started to use a router with a flush trim bit. On the third cutout on the second panel the bearing decided it had enough and left.......... I thin used my nice spiral flush cutting bit I use for veneer. Well, I had an oops and snapped that one in half. So I had to do the rest with the jig saw, then did a round-over on both sides of all the windows. Probably doesn't need to be done, but that was actually quite easy! PS: These are Vortex-15's.
Started gluing today. I typically clamp everything I glue then walk away for at least 6 hours. Decided to clamp, shoot a ton of brads into the clamped panels, wait an hour then move along with more panels. I don't have enough clamps to do all this at once, but this method seems to work just fine.
Ok, three main panels on, most of the bracing is in. My question is the area around the drivers. Is what I have in the pictures attached good? I plan on carrying the dual rails to the backside and then the other side (which is the top right now), and a single rail (which is in the picture) on the top panel. Is that enough? Doing it all this way I can mount the crossover to the top panel.
Keep it coming with the updates. Since Baltic Birch prices are ridiculous, I've been using HD cabinet Birch but I've noticed they bow a little and makes my glue up uneven. I might try MDF for the Vortex 15 build. Im just afraid of the mdf dust plus durability moving it around (I plan to switch the vortex around in my office and theater)
Slow day today. Glued all the bracing for one side up by the drivers. Probably can't rotate it to do another side until tomorrow. I just don't like the mess the glue makes when it isn't dry and starts to run and drip everywhere. Heck, no one will see it once the things are stuffed and together, but I'll know what it looks like, as well as people viewing the build here and AVS......... What I do like about MDF, it has all been perfectly flat! Yes, it is heavy and makes a ton of dust! I do all the work on it outside which is very easy for me. These are getting veneer so I don't need to do a lot of work on them after they are glued. But the Hammer sub enclosure I just built is getting painted to those end cuts need to be sealed and sanded. maybe this weekend.