I'm trying to decide between the Tempest and the Zephyr. I think they are identical, except for the woofer (actually, the ports and crossovers look different too). The Tempest is more sensitive (98 vs 95) and the Zephyr is spec'd to a lower freq (37 vs 47). There seems to be a lot of praise for the punchy mid-bass of the Tempest and the accurate flat response of the Zephyr. I'm hoping to power these with a 50 WAC Sonos ZP100 amp, preferably with no subs. The room (central great room) is large, 34 x 15 with 12' ceilings and open to the adjacent living room (which has its own system). I'm really looking for a speaker that sounds and feels like a rock and roll pa system. Something that is fun to listen to at loud (home alone) or moderate volumes. "Warmth" and "air" are more important to me than a perfect, flawless, and colorless reproduction. I like a speaker with an inviting personality. I think that I cannot go wrong with either. With the smaller amp, will I benefit from the additional 3 db of sensitivity of the Tempest? Will it be noticeably louder? It seems they both have good sensitivity. Which will I notice or feel in my chest more, the 10 db lower freq of the of the Zephyr or the punchier mid-bass of the Tempest? I listen to a lot of music, much of it in the classic rock, prog, and jam genres, but also trip hop, electronic, and a little electric jazz. The mrs likes dance, R&B, hip hop and rap. I also listen to a lot of Indy and low-fi. Any thoughts on which of these excellent designs may suit me better? I read elsewhere Jeff B. saying he prefers the Tempest, paired with a sub. (A sub is not out of the question for me, but would prefer no sub.) (Side note: would an Anarchy, if they become available again, be a good match for these? It seems counter intuitive to me to use a 6.5" woofer to augment bass on a 12" woofer system.) At any rate, these both look like exciting speakers. I already have a pair of Overnight Sensations that I need to build before I start these. Thanks, Pete
Welcome to the forum Club Chapin. I wouldn't think I'd want the Zephyr if running without subs. But 3db sensitivity is like doubling your amp output. So depends how loud is loud. At 98db/watt, I can't tolerate the 90 watts my receiver offers. It's just so loud. But some of the crazies around here like it very loud compared to me. So if you're one of those, you may want the added sens. I've seen quite a few posts from Jeff saying how much he loves listening to rock with the Tempests. I dunno man, it's kind of a personal thing you'll have to decide for yourself. I know I'd want the zephyr though, for the bass and because I'm not an SPL junkie.
The OP may have seen these already but others will come looking for this info: http://www.avsforum.com/t/1291022/hey-guys-we-need-a-little-rallying-here/6090#post_22681555 http://techtalk.parts-express.com/showthread.php?235069-So-who-s-going-to-build-Jeff-Bagby-s-Definimax-12-SEOS-Econowave&p=1874443#post1874443 http://techtalk.parts-express.com/showthread.php?235069-So-who-s-going-to-build-Jeff-Bagby-s-Definimax-12-SEOS-Econowave&p=1874981#post1874981 http://techtalk.parts-express.com/showthread.php?235069-So-who-s-going-to-build-Jeff-Bagby-s-Definimax-12-SEOS-Econowave&p=1876362#post1876362 Good info is out there but it is scattered around. I'd really like to see a thread for each kit where the first post collects all the specs, measurements/polar plots/waterfalls/etc. and a writeup from the designer explaining their goals for the design and why they made the decisions they did. Perhaps some thoughts on appropriate applications and amplification could be included as well as some newer DIY'ers (like me) may not be able to intuit these things just from looking at specs and graphs.
Thanks. I hadn't seen the avs link, or at least that portion of it. Very useful info, although I am still torn; both kits sound great! I'll likely go with the tempest and add a sub if I need to, although I would prefer not to. On a side note, I read the avs forum a few pages further and saw an Erich reference to crossover boards. I was unaware of these. Will they be available for the Bagby designs? I agree that it would be nice to have a thread for each kit that could also include additional tips and suggestions. Ie things like damping material, what kind and how much, etc. the other pertinent info for building a kit. (I see here, [SIZE=78%]http://www.avsforum.com/t/1291022/hey-guys-we-need-a-little-rallying-here/6120#post_22689073[/SIZE], that Jeff does not recommend it for his kits, this would be nice info to be easy to find.) Thanks, Pete
I think there was some confusion in the discussion with Jeff that you linked there. I'm pretty sure Jeff uses some damping material in his cabs. He was talking about baffle edge diffraction on the outside of the cab. Sometimes people use felt or damping on the baffle edges for narrow cabs with flush dome tweeters that cause diffraction quite high in frequency. He was saying he didn't do this because the diffraction is low in frequency (500hz). I agree with Jeff here. I think there's plans to have a designer Blog or something along those lines. Not sure where Erich is at with that. But something like that would work. For now I suggest pm'ing the designer and seeing what they say. Most of the designs have a thread you could post questions in also. Jeff isn't really involved in avsforum or diysoundgroup forum though, so you may need to get him over on Tech Talk.
I haven't executed on these yet. Need to finish some outstanding work around the house and have told myself I need to assemble my Overnight Sensations first. I looked at them today and see that the Tempest and Zephyr are now rated down to the same low freq., 37. What has changed, if anything, on the tempest? Also, I see that assembled cabinets may be available at some point in the near future. I would really be interested in this. Pete
The designer previously had the Tempest boxes tuned higher for more midbass "kick", but subsequently decided they lose nothing when tuned lower for more extension. Physically I believe all that changed is the ports are now cut a little shorter.
Excellent. I'm glad I waited. Sounds like nothing lost and a little gained. Decision made, Tempest for me!
Where can this info be found? Is there a better forum to find Jeff? I've seen reference to "tech talk". What and where is this? Is this where he communicates?
Forum where Jeff is quite active, thread about these designs: http://techtalk.parts-express.com/showthread.php?235069-So-who-s-going-to-build-Jeff-Bagby-s-Definimax-12-SEOS-Econowave&highlight=zephyr My statement about port tuning is something Erich said over on AVS, although I think Jeff mentioned it at some point too. Where, I can't remember.
Are the Tempest and Zephyr crossover schematics freely available somewhere or not ? I can't find them.
I have not seen them online anywhere. I'm thinking about this design with an active crossover, how easy would it be to do this?
Email Jeff and he should be able to provide and active xo. Unless he's to busy. I know Matt and I will provide settings for our designs if you'd like. Pretty sure Bill will as well. I don't think the passive xo is available for public viewing Good luck.
I've completed my OS and am ready to execute on a pair of Tempest. OS: http://www.diysoundgroup.com/forum/index.php?topic=233.0 I've got a couple questions: Is there a spec for the damping material (type, placement, quantity) for the Tempest? For the OS, I was able to find a layout for the crossover. Is this available for the Tempest somewhere? I see this "Options for assembled enclosures and assembled crossover boards coming soon." now on the Fusion page. Is there any information about this? I'd be inclined to consider assembled enclosures if and when available. I know that DIYSG is a hobby, so understand if it is a while. I'm sure nearly anyone could put these together better than I with my small collection of clamps.
I've received my new kit for the Tempest from Erich! I need to say a big thanks for him to put all of this together and do all of the work. As others have said, everything has arrived very well packaged. Thank you Erich! I look forward to putting these together and finally listening to them. Pete
Did you go with the assembled crossovers? Did Erich have assembled Tempest cabinets when you inquired?
Yes and yes. I haven't assembled them yet and will try to get some pics up. The quality of the assembled xo and cabinet are great.